Razgovor:Bosanska Banovina

Izvor: Wikipedija

Kako se kaze: car ili kralj :-/

Teško za reči, ako je kraljevstvo ili ima titulu nad nekim kraljevstvom kao kralj onda je kralj (npr. kralj bosne,, a ako je glava carstva (carstvo se može sastojati od mnogo kraljevstva, a time mnoge kraljevske titule postoje u teoriji), a la bizant, sveto rimsko carstvo, austrijsko carstvo, austrougarsko carstvo, itd. onda je valjda car, ali problem je u tome što to nije nikad bilo definirano kak spada, pa pitanje ti je nije loše.

idemo vidjeti što longman, cambridge i oxford kažu na to:

OXFORD:

KING= • noun 1 the male ruler of an independent state, especially one who inherits the position by birth. 2 the best or most important person or thing in a sphere or group. 3 a playing card bearing a representation of a king, ranking next below an ace. 4 the most important chess piece, which the opponent has to checkmate in order to win. 5 a piece in draughts with extra capacity for moving, made by crowning an ordinary piece that has reached the opponent’s baseline. 6 From the vocabulary word for a male monarch, bestowed, especially in America, with a hint of the notion that the bearer would have kingly qualities; cf. Duke and Earl. In some cases it may be a transferred use of the surname (originally a nickname or an occupational name given to someone who was employed in a royal household). Its frequency has increased recently as a Black name, no doubt partly in honour of the civil rights leader Martin Luther King (1929–68).

KINGDOM=

 • noun 1 a country, state, or territory ruled by a king or queen. 2 a realm associated with a particular person or thing. 3 the spiritual reign or authority of God. 4 each of the three divisions (animal, vegetable, and mineral) in which natural objects are classified. 

EMPEROR=

 • noun the ruler of an empire. 

EMPIRE=

 • noun 1 an extensive group of states ruled over by a single monarch or ruling authority. 2 supreme political power. 3 a large commercial organization under the control of one person or group. 
 • adjective (Empire) denoting a neoclassical style of furniture and dress fashionable chiefly during the First Empire (1804-15) in France. 

CAMBRIDGE:

king (RULER) noun [C] 1 (the title of) a male ruler of a country, who holds this position because of his royal birth:

King Richard II the kings and queens of England

2 the most important, best or most impressive member of a group of animals, things or people: The lion is often called the king of the jungle. He's the new king of pop music.

3 In the game of chess, the king is the most important piece on the board. It can move one square in any direction.

4 a card with a picture of a king on it, used in games: the king of hearts

kingdom noun [C] 1 a country ruled by a king or queen: the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland

2 an area which is controlled by a particular person or where a particular quality is important: the kingdom of God/Heaven the kingdom of love

3 LITERARY an area of activity: the kingdom of the theatre the kingdoms of the mind

4 one of the groups into which natural things can be divided, depending on their type: the animal/plant kingdom

emperor noun [C] a male ruler of an empire

empire (COUNTRIES) noun [C] a group of countries ruled by a single person, government or country: the Holy Roman Empire

ak ti baš treba, lOL: empire (ORGANIZATION) noun [C] a very large and important business or organization: In the space of just ten years, her company has grown from one small shop to a multi-million-pound empire


NEMAM LONGMANA PRI RUCI, ALI EVO WIKIPEDIJE:

An emperor is a (male) monarch, usually the sovereign ruler of an empire or another type of imperial realm. Empress is the feminine form. As a title, "empress" may indicate the wife of an emperor (empress consort) or a woman who is a ruling monarch (empress regnant). Emperors are generally recognized to be above kings in honour and rank.

A male monarch, or a head of state (see Germanic king for the origins of the word "king" and for the traditional kings of Germanic countries)

Daj reči konkretni primjer...

--H0zz3R 11:38, 9. ožujak 2007. (CET)

Meni se čini, da nema smisla tako ekstenzivno citirati engleske rječnike. Postoje i hrvatski za tu temu. Osim toga, relativno je lako nabrojati sve države i vladare u povijesti koje nazivamo "carevima".
Konkretno: ne postoji veliki broj ljudi u povijesti, koje nazivamo "carevima", odnosno država, koje su nazivane "carstvima". Car vlada nad puno zemalja, uključujući eventualno i njihove kraljeve.
Carstva su bila:
  • Rimsko
  • Perzijsko
  • Bizantsko
  • Franačko, zatim "Sveto Rimsko Carstvo"
  • Austrija odnosno Austrougarska
  • kratko vrijeme Srbija i Bugarska
  • Rusija
  • Britanska kraljica Viktorija bila je "carica indije"
Svi carevi u Europi pzivali su se, neposredno ili posredno, na nasljeđe Rimskoga carstva.
Zapadno Rismo carstvo --> Franačko --> Sveto Rimsko Carstvo --> Austrijsko
Istočno Rimsko carstvo --> Bizant --> (Srbija i Bugarska) --> Rusija (Moskava kao "Treći Rim")
Te van Europe:
  • Države Asteka i Maja
  • Kina
  • Japan
  • Neko vrijeme Indija )car Ašoka)
  • Maksilmilijan Habsburški nazivao je sebe "car Meksika".
  • Pojedini vladari raznih područja, kratkotrajne vladavine.
Po smislu riječi, bagdadski kalifi i osmanlijski sultani su također carevi, ali koristimo te posebne titule. Slično i Đingis kan, pa stari egipatski faraoni. Prije Rimskog carstva, još poneke vladare nazivamo carevima.
Možda sam nekog zaboravio, ali ovo je uglavnom potpun popis. Sve ostalo su kraljevstva i kraljevi!--Fausto 16:28, 12. ožujak 2007. (CET)
Evo malo sam ovo popravio i dopunio pa stavio u članak car!--Fausto 18:35, 15. ožujak 2007. (CET)

hmmm... ovo ti nije baš precizno, znam hrpu povijesničara koji se nebi složili, jer je stvarno mutni pojam, a ti uvodiš tezu koja s kojom se nemože služi povijest nažalost...

--89.172.140.251 11:12, 22. ožujak 2007. (CET)

Ne razumijem, na koju se "tezu" ovo odnosi? Možeš li ukazati na neku stručnu literaturu po kojoj je "car" "mutan" pojam? Ako 'definicija što je to car i tko se smatra carem naravno i nije baš laka, za povijest to nije bitan problem - zaista, stoji teza da se zna koga se sve u historiografiji naziva "carem" i koje države "carstvima". Popis nije dug, dakako može biti poneki sporni slučaj, ali za veliku većinu ostoji konsenzus među povjesničarima.--Fausto 21:00, 24. ožujak 2007. (CET)