time |
User |
comment |
19:10:38 |
Pathoschild has joined #spc-lang-com |
19:10:46 |
Pathoschild |
Hey. |
19:10:46 |
SabineCretella |
hi :-) |
19:10:53 |
Pathoschild |
:) |
19:10:57 |
SabineCretella |
well: I would say we are not going to do it |
19:11:07 |
SabineCretella |
otherwise we would not sleep anymore |
19:11:55 |
SabineCretella |
Belarus is another one of these nice thingies ... |
19:12:04 |
Pathoschild |
Hmm... GerardM implied you would in an email he sent me. I'm wondering whether I should keep closing old requests and inviting users to re-open under the policy, or just let the subcommittee deal with them. |
19:12:19 |
SabineCretella |
whoops ... |
19:12:34 |
SabineCretella |
all the old language requests??? are you sure he understood well? |
19:12:55 |
Pathoschild |
I don't know; maybe he just wasn't aware of how many there are. :) |
19:13:07 |
SabineCretella |
that would be a massive amount of work where 90% does not really make sense |
19:13:15 |
Pathoschild |
Yep. |
19:13:19 |
SabineCretella |
I'll talk to him about that ... |
19:13:42 |
SabineCretella |
It is already difficult to keep pace with the actual things |
19:14:00 |
Pathoschild nods. |
19:14:07 |
SabineCretella |
Btw. as for Belarus: we had someone having a look at it ... |
19:14:41 |
SabineCretella |
There are some issues on contents to be solved - also on ru.wikipedia - the thing is: Gerard and me will not be here next week |
19:15:04 |
SabineCretella |
no ... siberian |
19:15:05 |
SabineCretella |
sorry |
19:15:15 |
SabineCretella |
it is simply getting too much these days |
19:15:39 |
Pathoschild nods. |
19:16:18 |
SabineCretella |
he is also looking at the other wikis around - just to understand |
19:16:51 |
Pathoschild |
One other question, though you may not like the extra work it implies. GerardM implied the subcommittee will be making all decisions on requests. If so, I'll remove the Meta administrators from the decision-making part of the policy and shuffle in the subcommittee. Right? |
19:16:58 |
Pathoschild nods. |
19:17:52 |
SabineCretella |
Well: I would like to see co-operation between meta and the langcom |
19:17:54 |
Pathoschild |
I'm still not sure whether we'll have the subcommittee doing everything, or overseeing a shared workload with the administrators. |
19:18:16 |
SabineCretella |
Some of us would also like to see you in the subcom |
19:18:43 |
SabineCretella |
Others are not there at the moment, so we will ask them as soon as they are here |
19:18:48 |
Pathoschild |
ok. |
19:18:59 |
SabineCretella |
Then I will come back to you |
19:19:26 |
Pathoschild |
When is the next meeting planned? I'd like to resolve how the workload will be managed soon, before the process is backlogged. :) |
19:19:48 |
SabineCretella |
uhmmm ... good question |
19:20:03 |
SabineCretella |
I'll try to propose a date in the week before Christmas |
19:20:14 |
SabineCretella |
this means after the Wiki-meetup in Belgrad |
19:20:19 |
Pathoschild |
ok. |
19:20:21 |
SabineCretella |
Gerard will be there as well |
19:21:22 |
SabineCretella |
I have to understand my time schedule in Germany to be able to find out some possible dates. I hop I will know that soon |
19:21:59 |
Pathoschild nods. |
19:22:18 |
SabineCretella |
Do you feel we need board approval for the Belarus language problem? |
19:22:27 |
SabineCretella |
Because we have a proposal for that ... |
19:25:06 |
Pathoschild |
I have no idea. Under the current policy, administrators and the subcommittee approve and deny requests, create a brief summary, and submit that to the board. That makes it much easier for the board to consider requests, since they don't have to read through the discussion. The subcommittee doesn't seem to support the current policy, though, so I have no idea how we'll manage this and other requests yet. |
19:26:09 |
SabineCretella |
Well: we know we exist - we know we can handle certain stuff ... but ... sigh ... |
19:26:21 |
SabineCretella |
I'll try to get that e-mail on the way |
19:26:24 |
SabineCretella |
again |
19:26:25 |
Pathoschild |
Thanks. |
19:27 |
SabineCretella |
The Language Subcommittee of the Special Projects Committee
approximately a week ago had a meeting concerning, among other questions, the solution of the be.wikipedia problem.
Acutal state of the be.wikipedia is that it is written in a language
that does not conform to official standards. These standards were
created from the beginning of the XX century with its last amendment by
law in 1985. This means that the actual valid ortography and grammar has
its own history and moreover is based on public law. What we actually
have on that wikipedia is a "we would like to have" language. That means
pople are trying to get "the old times back". Well: nobody wants people
to deny to write and read an old version of a language, but the official
wikipedia for a language should respect the public language that is
taught at school and university, the language you will find legal
documents etc. in.
Therefore we propose the following way to solve the issue:
- The Belarusian wikipedia that uses old ortography and grammar is moved
to another domain name and will get in such a way its own right to
exist. We suggest be-alt2005 (see notes about that below).
- The official language code domain for Belarusian is being attributed
to the official ortography and grammar.
Out of the many possibilities in the end the code be-alt2005 was chosen
based on the following reasons: the actual valid ortography and grammar
stems from the ortography and grammar of 1939 and before. So giving such
a code would mix up things. The new "we want this unofficial grammar and
ortography" was brought up in 2005 and so it is an alternation of the
actual official language that occurred in 2005, which takes up rules and
ortography from "ancient times".
I tried to keep this e-mail as simple as possible (it takes hours to
understand what was done when and how for Belarusian and it would take a
|
19:28 |
SabineCretella |
very long e-mail do explain this here again) - the whole history of the
language is well described on the English Wikipedia.
Of course any solution regarding languages will always have people that
are in favour or against - the above solution is the most logical one
that should suite all needs.
|
19:28:11 |
SabineCretella |
this is what we have |
19:31:22 |
Pathoschild |
I'm not well-aware of the differences between the standardised and traditional Belarussian, so I can't really comment. I don't see the need to split them into separate wikis, but I imagine good reasons came up in the meeting. |
19:33:05 |
SabineCretella |
Hmmmm ... should we take up this theme again in the meeting before Christmas? |
19:33:43 |
SabineCretella |
I don't think the board will decide on this now and considering the Montenegrin bit and what will follow probably an integration makes sense |
19:34:07 |
SabineCretella |
but: the main page should then be in th official version of Belarussian and not the old version |
19:34:13 |
Pathoschild |
Yep. |
19:34:20 |
SabineCretella |
the old version should be a subpage of the standardised version |
19:34:52 |
SabineCretella |
that will be harder to get since the actual be.wikipedia was somewhat raped by the "we would like to have old times back" people |
19:35:02 |
SabineCretella |
don't know if raped is the correct word |
19:35:14 |
SabineCretella |
and they do not allow for standard language there |
19:35:21 |
Pathoschild |
Perhaps they could just have separate pages with two category trees. |
19:35:41 |
SabineCretella |
at least that is what I understood from Yurik |
19:36:02 |
SabineCretella |
well yes, but if the page title is the same ... or disambiguation ... |
19:36:06 |
SabineCretella |
?? |
19:36:51 |
Pathoschild |
"Title (traditional)" and "Title (standard)", maybe? Or put them both on one page with Language select? |
19:37:07 |
Pathoschild |
That wouldn't work well with very large pages, though. |
19:37:26 |
SabineCretella |
better separate pages |
19:37:31 |
Pathoschild |
Yep. |
19:37:44 |
SabineCretella |
once we will have multilingual mediawiki it will be easier to transfer data |
19:38:07 |
SabineCretella |
ok, I'll propose this again for the agenda |
19:38:46 |
timichal (n=notafili@wikimedia/timichal) has joined #spc-lang-com |
19:38:50 |
SabineCretella |
sometimes things simply don't happen by chance :-) |
19:38:50 |
timichal |
hi kids |
19:38:54 |
Pathoschild |
Is the agenda on a wiki page somewhere? It'd be easier to be organised if we have a centralised page for points we'll bring up. |
19:38:57 |
Pathoschild |
Hey. :) |
19:38:59 |
SabineCretella |
hi timichal :-) |
19:39:04 |
timichal |
what's up? |
19:39:13 |
SabineCretella |
be.wikipedia again |
19:39:20 |
SabineCretella |
and to say the truth: I am happy that |
19:39:28 |
SabineCretella |
a) or my mail did not reach the board |
19:39:37 |
SabineCretella |
b) or they did not have time to talk about it |
19:40:22 |
SabineCretella |
if montenegrin has to live with serbian ... then the official belorussian should live with the unofficial ortography |
19:40:36 |
SabineCretella |
havin the official ortography as basis on be.wikipedia |
19:40:58 |
SabineCretella |
will we propose this as a theme for the next meeting? |
19:41:09 |
SabineCretella |
I'll try to schedule one in the week before christmas |
19:41:11 |
Pathoschild |
They're mutually understandable; I don't think we should have wikis for individual dialects, standards, et cetera. |
19:41:33 |
SabineCretella |
well on nap we have also various versions of nap |
19:41:42 |
SabineCretella |
or better: we allow for them |
19:42:35 |
SabineCretella |
the funny thing will be <a bit ironical> to have them take the pill ... |
19:44:47 |
SabineCretella |
ok Pathoschild ... I have a nice majority here: |
19:45:41 |
SabineCretella |
Gerard +1, Timichal +1, Berto +1, JHS +1, me +1, Karen and Ascander missing - I'd say: if you would like to be in the language committee: welcome and have fun :-) |
19:46:01 |
SabineCretella |
to which e-mail address may I send my welcome message? |
19:46:01 |
timichal |
could you create an account for him? |
19:46:13 |
timichal |
or should I |
19:46:19 |
SabineCretella |
on langcom? |
19:46:21 |
timichal |
yes |
19:46:24 |
timichal |
that reminds me |
19:46:26 |
timichal |
OMG POLICY! |
19:46:30 |
SabineCretella |
if you could do that, this would be great |
19:46:34 |
timichal |
*I*, for one, totally forgot |
19:46:37 |
SabineCretella |
I am down under with work |
19:46:49 |
timichal |
and others apparently don't care |
19:46:59 |
SabineCretella |
two meeting + finishing to write a presntation tomorrow |
19:47:01 |
timichal looks at Pathoschild expectantly ;P |
19:47:12 |
SabineCretella |
lol OMG? |
19:48:11 |
Pathoschild |
Sorry, I was away a few minutes. :) |
19:48:24 |
SabineCretella |
ahhhh .... read up please ;-) |
19:48:34 |
timichal |
gimme your mail address Pathoschild |
19:48:39 |
Pathoschild |
My email address is <...>. Thanks. :) |
19:49:09 |
timichal |
The password for "Pathoschild" has been sent to <...>. |
19:50:45 |
timichal |
User "Pathoschild" is now a sysop |
19:51:25 |
Pathoschild |
Merci. |
19:51:42 |
timichal |
you're welcome ;) |
19:52:18 |
timichal |
I wonder what happens if XWin.exe get realtime priority 0:) |
19:52:29 |
timichal |
*+correct english |
19:54:24 |
SabineCretella |
Mail sent :-) |
19:55:02 |
SabineCretella |
and now ... I am going to bed ... have to get up early |
19:55:07 |
SabineCretella |
good night!!! |
19:55:15 |
Pathoschild |
Good night. |
19:55:34 |
timichal |
nn Sabine |
19:58:20 |
Pathoschild |
Should we move the content at [http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Langcom] to the langcom wiki main page? |
20:01:22 |
timichal |
if you want :) |